DART Central Station

[Better Life dude]

I would think that it's a done deal since the I-Jobs got passed and the stimulus money is coming. Also since Culver is making a public display of the Chicago-Des Moines connection. As it's all a part of the Transit Mall.

I would temper optimism since every municipality was taking every project down off their shelves and throwing them into the proposed stimulus pot. It would be great if this project does happen this year.

All I can find for actual amounts allocated for Federal Stimulus funds for Des Moines area public transit is this from IDOT dated March 9, 2009:
http://www.iowadot.gov/recovery/pdfs/Section5340UrbanizedAreaApportionments.pdf

Des Moines $7,888,026 for Transit Assistance Program

The DART proposals include an $18.8 million transit hub; developing a $70 million downtown tram system; buying eight new buses for a total of $3 million; and spending $3 million to update shelters and build a new Park and Ride facility.

Clearly DART won't be getting everything it wants - even when the downtown tram system is not figured in.

[DMRyan]

From what little insider info I know about the stimulus program from the movers and shakers, this transit hub stands an extremely good chance of being funded. I believe the plan is to stop being so reliant on the Walnut Street Transit Mall as the transfer hub to better open up its redevelopment opportunities. Couple this transit hub with a rail station for the proposed expansion of commuter rail over the coming years, and it makes sense. Wouldn't be surprised to see the funding for new buses get approved as well. The downtown trolley is something that isn't a sure bet for any funding. I doubt that the I-Jobs funding could put a dent in the total cost and I still think the $70 million number being thrown around is on the extremely low end. The trolley will likely need a mix of local funding, annual federal transit funding, and those important downtown corporate dollars to get anywhere. Allied/Nationwide has already graciously stepped up to the plate to fund the study, who will be next once we get out of the economic doldrums?

[Mototail]

I agree with DMRyan on this. That's kind of how I was reading things as well. There's $2 Billion of federal stimulus money out there along with the I-JOBS money.

I'll keep my fingers crossed that all this will happen as I'd love to see that Virginia developer proceed with his project. I think clearing out the Walnut transit mall will create opportunity for further investment in the Younker's building along with the surrounding area.

[Cyclonefan]

Looks like there's a possibility of moving the site for the station
http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009907070347

[DMRyan]

I'm not sold on the location either. I just don't get why it would go there, where streets oddly converge. Does this parcel have enough space to accommodate parking, cab stands, a possible rental car kiosk, etc. that may become needed in the future if this really is a terminal of sorts for multi-modal transportation? It is handy to take advantage of any future passenger rail expansion that may or may not come to DSM, but it doesn't sound like this proposal is addressing this at this time. Go for it all, and get a better charter bus shelter too to get people out of the hideously dated Greyhound station along with allowing easy expansion for a rail terminal, should it be warranted.

I hope they go back to the drawing board on the location for this, understanding that the list of potential sites is probably pretty short. They have their pick of large surface parking lots taking up the entire block and still on the rail line in pretty much any direction from this location, but that probably wouldn't address great road access and it certainly doesn't get it any closer to the core.

[Mastermind]

Has anyone seen what Anaheim, Ca is doing. They are going to have an amazing intermodal facility.
http://www.ocregister.com/photos/design-transportation-center-2429498-anaheim-site

[BenRoethig]

I'm not sold on the location either. I just don't get why it would go there, where streets oddly converge. Does this parcel have enough space to accommodate parking, cab stands, a possible rental car kiosk, etc. that may become needed in the future if this really is a terminal of sorts for multi-modal transportation? It is handy to take advantage of any future passenger rail expansion that may or may not come to DSM, but it doesn't sound like this proposal is addressing this at this time. Go for it all, and get a better charter bus shelter too to get people out of the hideously dated Greyhound station along with allowing easy expansion for a rail terminal, should it be warranted.

I hope they go back to the drawing board on the location for this, understanding that the list of potential sites is probably pretty short. They have their pick of large surface parking lots taking up the entire block and still on the rail line in pretty much any direction from this location, but that probably wouldn't address great road access and it certainly doesn't get it any closer to the core.

Yeah. Personally, I'd do a master intermodal station on those lots between 7-9th and Cherry.

[DMRyan]

This is more Walnut Street transit-mall related than the new bus transfer center, but the city and the Downtown Community Alliance will be painted the outdated looking maroon light fixtures, traffic lights and bus shelters black to match the rest of the downtown streetscape.

(Photo Courtesy of the Living Downtown Des Moines blog)

[mirage1]

Should we look to the vast expanses of suburbia? That clearly doesn't work.

Couch, please quit saying total BS like this. For those of us living in the Glen Oaks/West Glen/Ponderosa area, we certainly feel we have the best of all worlds. It works JUST fine. Reality shows suburbia is an attractive alternative. Maybe it isn't right for all, but this is "clearly working"... and very very well for those here.

Wasn't Urbandale again in the top cities in America?

I suggest in the strongest possible terms you get off your anti-suburbia kick.

[changeyourview]

Did you catch this article on the proposed Transit Hub in the April 14th issue of ArchitectsPaper? New images and great editorial about our downtown and this project: http://www.archpaper.com/e-board_rev.asp?News_ID=4429

[hawk61401]

Yes, that's a great article about Des Moines. I posted it last Thursday on the riverwalk thread. It makes our city look pretty darn gooood.

There's another piece in that issue of The Architect's Newspaper with a Des Moines angle ...



Why is that car going the wrong way on Grand Ave? That is the corner of 6th and Grand in downtown Des Moines? No, look again. That is a picture of The Martin Luther King Library in Washington, D.C. It was designed by Mies van der Rohe. This was his last building and it was recently awarded recognition to the National Honor Roll.

The building at 6th and Grand in Des Moines was also designed by Mies van der Rohe.

photo attributed to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MLK_Library.jpg

[DMRyan]

The Business Record reports that this project received $4 million in I-Jobs funding to bring it closer to reality, but it's still in line for additional transportation earmarks before the $20 million+ price tag is met. The remainder of the funding may come through in June with an opening in 2012 if all goes according to plan.

Check out the dramatically dulled-down design. Apparently the last design was a little too rich for $20. Too bad because it was a pretty eye-catching design as far as transit hubs go.

A link to the full Business Record article on this project:
http://www.businessrecord.com/main.asp? ... cleID=9945

[DMRyan]

I'm still trying to digest the new design of this transit hub, now that it's been flashed on the news a little more. It's hard to tell, but it looks like the 2 story building has the appearance of a utilitarian metal paneled shed. As always, the dollar dictates reality. We went from a conceptual design for an architectural icon to what quite possibly appears to be an underbuilt utilization of a future development tract.

[dogbo]

There are a bunch of renderings that just went up on the Drive Time Des Moines Facebook page if you're able to grab those.

[Ingersoll1978]

There are a bunch of renderings that just went up on the Drive Time Des Moines Facebook page if you're able to grab those.

Much better renderings than that other one. Now I'm much excited to see this go up.

Here are the renderings:

[speeder]

Great looking transit hub However, is the old Polk County Jail still looking to be the new YMCA.... right next to a sleek new bus terminal partially meant to attract (and this is an assumption on my part) suburban and inner-urban commuters to the joys of riding DART for work commuting...when the buses aren't hitting people anyway. Nothing like leaving your private, pricey and comfortable car at home in the garage to willingly render yourself dependent on a bus schedule AND get on and off the bus to rub elbows with the guys living the YMCA life every morning and evening.

[DMRyan]

The jail annex that will be the home for the new YMCA Transitional Housing facility is about two blocks to the west. Probably best saved for the appropriate thread, but the demo on the old jail annex should happen very soon if it's not underway with demo prep work already. I've tried in vain to find renderings online, but haven't had any luck. It's no headturner, but it's a $13 million dollar project.

I agree with the above, enough design tweaks to this transit hub to not make it look so cheap. I kind of like this, it has the open modern feel that the Pappajohn Higher Ed Center (or whatever it's being called now) has.

[DMRyan]

Also, note the gyrosphere type wind turbines shown in the rendering, just to the east of the building.

[hawk61401]

I guess we're still waiting on that 16 million dollar grant money from the U.S. Department of Transportation and the Federal Transit Administration to complete the funding for the project.

http://thebusblog.ridedart.com/2010/06/ ... ansit-hub/

[dogbo]

OK...I'm going to say it.

Shouldn't something like this be more centrally located?

[Des Moineser]

OK...I'm going to say it.

Shouldn't something like this be more centrally located?

If the tram goes in like it is supposed to, I don't think its location will end up being so bad, especially if it is coupled with Amtrak service someday.

[Streetwalker]

I use the bus and like the whole idea, except, I wonder how this moves downtown Des Moines closer to bringing the skywalks closer to street level pedestrians. Is there a grand skywalk access somewhere?

[BenRoethig]

I'd shift it over one block. If Amtrak comes, you can use the DART facility without blocking traffic and you have easy access to the city parking ramp across the street.

[Streetwalker]

Also, While I love the idea of a higher speed Amtrak coming into Des Moines, I question whether it is good for the rest of downtown to bring a passenger train into the center of downtown twice a day. The noise could be disruptive to residents and office workers. Amtrak should go into the DSM airport and take advantage of the existing parking, baggage handing and security.

[BenRoethig]

Good thing its going into the lower outskirts of downtown then. Plus there's the little issue of the track bed going by DSM International being a bike path now.

[SharpHawkeye]

OK...I'm going to say it.

Shouldn't something like this be more centrally located?

I imagine this is something you want close by but not next door if you're looking for a place to live or work or build a new corporate office tower . Buses, trams, trains, cars, so on and so on are loud and dirty.

[Mastermind]

I dont think i would notice a train at work. Now living is a different story.

[BenRoethig]

Unless you're right next to the tracks, train quickly become a non=issue.

[vauxhall]

There have been one or two posts questioning the proximity of the DART facility to the central downtown area and I thought of a couple of comments regarding the planned location. Firstly, if this will be the terminus for a number of bus routes, it will be noisy (due to idling buses) and a bit of an annoyance with buses pulling in and out of it all day long so I think it makes perfect sense to have it a block or two away from the other downtown bustle. Secondly (and I'm sincere in stating that this is not meant to be snarky), it wouldn't kill people to have to walk another 3 to 5 to 8 blocks to their workplaces! It seems that workers can't bear to walk more than a block or two from their car or bus stop or parking ramp to their jobs. What's up with that? I worked in Downtown Des Moines during most of the 90's before moving here and in fact, I lived my last year in Des Moines as a downtown resident so am familiar with the layout and the locations of major employers. Currently, I live in a condo 5 miles north of downtown Chicago but enjoy taking a Metra train downtown rather than bother with CTA trains (Metra = cleaner, quieter, fewer odd people). If I walk from my condo to the nearest Metra station, it is a 25 minute walk. Yes - 25 minutes. In extreme heat or cold, I take a bus part way but still end up walking about 10 minutes. The trip on the Metra train is only 13 minutes long and once I'm downtown, it's about another 10 minute walk to my building. You just do what you have to do and you know what? That walk gives you a chance to clear your head, move your body, and notice a few things you don't see from inside a vehicle. I was always a bit mystified with many of my former DSM colleagues and their notion that actually having to walk more than a few blocks to get somewhere was pure drudgery.

[DesMoinesRunner]

This all just seems so... pie in the sky. Sure there will be some sort of DART hub, probably in that general area, and whether there's Amtrak there is immaterial (AMTRAK by the airport, are you you kidding me?) But for those old enuf to remember, 30 years ago the Walnut Transit Mall was the end all be all saviour for downtown. It only resulted in finally killing off ground floor retail downtown for the next three decades. Please keep it south of downtown by MLK. Keep the buses running through downtown, but please don't make a big transfer station in the heart of the business district. Like Walnut in early 1980's it will just destroy the area around it. By the way where's the "green roof" and such from the design 2 years ago?