Downtown YMCA

[Better Life dude]

The mosaics on the walls of the indoor pool are very cool, too.

[Mototail]

http://www.dmregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll ... 001&lead=1

the wind is starting to fly....?

[DMRyan]

I'm not singling out people here but as a rule, if you're not going to post the whole news article, please select what you feel to be the important quotes from the article so more information can be provided. Simply posting a link does nothing to drive discussion.

If you do post the entire article, put the article in quotes and make sure to cite the source of the article. Please, just try to elaborate a little more on these news items.

[dogbo]

A little update in the business section of the Register today. Interesting to note all the different components that they are looking at including some residential.

Here's the full article: http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/p ... 90379/1029

A lot of unanswered questions surround what will happen to the space that's been occupied by the Riverfront YMCA for the past half-century.

Word is there will be no formal announcement until the YMCA secures a permanent new location for its 150 residents, which could be soon.

Paul Rottenberg of Orchestrate Management, who is involved in the project, is telling folks that developer Jon Garnaas has some innovative stuff in mind, including an 80,000-square-foot state-of-the-art fitness center that would continue to be run by the YMCA.

The rest of the plan is still in flux but could include some, or all, of the following: a 140-room hotel, 150,000 square feet of office space, a residential component, retail space and underground parking.

The two-acre site on the west bank of the Des Moines River offers a lot of possibilities. To keep development consistent with riverwalk plans, buildings nearest the river would be no more than two stories in height. Buildings set back from the river and fronting on Second Avenue, Grand Avenue or Locust Street could be as tall as, or taller than, the 8-story Embassy Suites hotel on the opposing bank of the river.

[Better Life dude]

Wouldn't a riverfront YMCA where while you're on the eliptical or treadmill you look out a big glass wall onto the river walk and the East side skyline be cool? That's what we're talking about. We joined the downtown Y a couple months ago and we love the location and every thing they offer there. A state of the art fitness facility downtown makes me drool with anticipation!

[Bluestem]

This could turn out to be quite a big project if it pans out the way that article reads; and I like your idea BLD about the two story Y facing the river, Evil, and the capital. That would be a killer view.

[DMRyan]

I hope the developer is thinking big here, if they can make the numbers work. This has the makings of a first rate project on the most visible site on the riverwalk. Interesting that they're eyeing a hotel component too. One or two new downtown hotel proposals could put the nail in the coffin for the 'need' to build a subsidized convention hotel for the time being (not that it should be written off for the future though).

[Bluestem]

I agree that they really, really, really need to think big on this project.

[Hojo]

I like how Rottenberg is quoted there...I can almost guarantee he's lobbying for some of that space for a restaurant

[dogbo]

Well, he does both restaurants and hotels, why wouldn't you assume both?

[4th&Court]

This project looks like something that could be HUGE for downtown DSM. A premiere hotel right on the river would be a great addition.

[DMRyan]

The uproar begins! Perhaps it is best to take this slow and truly find a suitable location for this site that might not be close to schools. I really don't find the lack of transit down Dean Avenue to be an obsticle because it has already been said that the YMCA intends to plan shuttle service to get the residents back downtown.

What other areas of the city would be appropriate for this type of facility?

East-siders tell YMCA: Go elsewhere
The prospect of putting a transitional housing facility in the area is roundly criticized at a public meeting.

By TODD ERZEN
REGISTER STAFF WRITER


October 25, 2007

Not in our backyard. Many of the 150-plus east-side residents at Wednesday night's public meeting with YMCA officials at Willard Elementary School delivered that message.

The YMCA wants to move its downtown Riverfront transitional housing facility to 5.5 acres at Dean Avenue and East 28th Street, but opponents of the move expressed concerns about increased crime and lowered property values and insisted that the facility would be better suited for other locations in the city.

"We aren't saying we don't support (the men at the YMCA)," said LeAnna Byers of 2724 Dean Ave. "We are saying, 'Don't put them in our neighborhood.' "

Riverfront Executive Director Scott Harris came prepared with caseworkers, an architect and former residents of the facility to try to show how the current operation works and what a new $6 million, 150-bed Fairground neighborhood complex might look like.

Dissenters regularly interrupted the presentations, and the YMCA's previously advertised promise of a publicly accessible medical clinic, workout facility and playground failed to appease them.

YMCA officials appeared before the Fairground Neighborhood Association in mid-September to inform it of the possible move, which comes as the Principal Riverwalk nears completion in downtown Des Moines and the 50-year-old transitional housing facility is being considered as a location for a hotel and street-level shops and restaurants.

At that meeting, YMCA officials said the transitional housing facility allowed no sex offenders and enforced a no-tolerance policy on drugs and alcohol, and that most of the residents worked at jobs during the day.

"The guys who live there are trying," Harris said. "They are trying to reorganize their lives."

Some at Wednesday's meeting said they felt as if their neighborhood was being made a dumping ground for whatever the rest of the city didn't want.

"Where do you people live?" Don Current of 2912 Dean Ave. asked Harris and the other YMCA officials. "You sure don't live on the east side, do you?"

That question drew applause, and after an hour and a half of almost exclusively negative feedback, Des Moines City Councilman Brian Meyer, who represents the area and had requested the meeting, said he would not be able to support the facility at the Dean Avenue location.

"I had stated previously that I was going to keep an open mind until I heard from more of the public, but at this point I will be voting no," Meyer said. "I have to listen to these neighbors."

The YMCA has not yet purchased the Dean Avenue land, which is zoned for industrial use only. The Des Moines Planning and Zoning Commission would have to reclassify the land to permit the project, but it will not take up the issue until next month. After that, the plan would go before the City Council.

[Better Life dude]

I'd say park this transitional housing next door to the Save the Green NIMBYs in Beaverdale. Perhaps fill up the proposed row houses to be built on the Rice School site.

Seriously, there are so many surface lots and abandoned lots in Des Moines. There must be some place to park a project like this - especially with the promise of a family healh clinic attatched to it.

[QuadCityImages]

"We aren't saying we don't support (the men at the YMCA)," said LeAnna Byers of 2724 Dean Ave. "We are saying, 'Don't put them in our neighborhood.' "

That's one of the closer quotes I've seen to someone actually saying "Not In My Backyard!"

[hawk61401]

I don't know why they wouldn't want the YMCA on the East Side. Come and see what's coool on the east side ...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KnMnCJC20nU

[Young DSM Social Club]

I don't blame them a bit. Let's see another city other than DSM finally take on some community responsibilities.

I don't think this should be a west DSM vs. east DSM vs. south DSM type of situation. EVERY part of DSM proper houses community services/programs such as this.

I liked the person asked the head honchos where they live. Curious what response they got ...

I think the Y is a good program, but wouldn't want this next door to my home either.

[Ingersoll1978]

I don't know why they wouldn't want the YMCA on the East Side. Come and see what's coool on the east side ...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KnMnCJC20nU

That video is kinda humorous...I feel bad for laughing...

[4th&Court]

Hard to blame either side.

Eastsiders, like anyone else, drive past the YMCA downtown and see what? Groups of dumpy-looking people sitting around smoking cigarettes and glaring at anyone who walks or drives by. Occasionally, they might take the time to utter "What up girl" or "Yeah swing that thang" or some other quote reflecting real desirable social skills. At night, these people engage in the same activity as so many other vagrants downtown--aggressively asking people for cash.

Meanwhile, anyone looking for a place to move this facility to sees the level of pride that many--not all--eastsiders take in the appearance of their homes. They see the blue-tarp windows and couches on the lawn or porches. They see the $40k quad-cab parked outside the house with huge chunks of siding missing. They see a pile of tires at the end of a driveway that hasn't moved in years.

I am neutral on the YMCA moving to the proprosed location, but I can surely see the reason for both positions.

[dogbo]

At the end of the day, the Y has to purchase the land for their new building and thus it has to be affordable. Chances are, they're not going to find affordable land near downtown or on the west side.

[hawk61401]

What's wrong with this picture? ..

One of the people who attended last night's YMCA meeting said that she has had personal experience with the YMCA program because she has had family members who have fallen through the cracks. She knows what "these" people are like and she doesn't want them in her neighborhood.

I would bet that some of those who screamed the loudest last night would also claim to be Christians. But if you can't even show love and compassion for your own family member, why care for a complete stranger? This is very sad.

[Ingersoll1978]

I would bet that some of those who screamed the loudest last night would also claim to be Christians. But if you can't even show love and compassion for your own family member, why care for a complete stranger? This is very sad.

You'd find the same reaction from ANY neighborhood where this is proposed. I do believe that other cities should step up to the plate and take the burden of some of these facilities (if they are good enough to take our employers, they should be good enough to take these too). Could you imagine the uproar if this was proposed south of Railroad Avenue in West Des Moines?

[4th&Court]

At any rate, it would be nice if there was just a little less incentive for every vagrant in the city to roam our newly-booming downtown area and beg/intimidate people all day. Oh, and defecate in lobbies and elevators.

[hawk61401]

I don't recall The Door of Faith Mission or the Bethel Mission in downtown Des Moines having the complaints or problems that the YMCA has. Below is a pic of the former Door of Faith location on Grand Ave. The Door of Faith Building was not set back off the street like the YMCA is. So, there was less room for milling about. The Door of Faith was disciplined. If you didn't abide by the rules, you were gone.

I also don't recall the neighbors raising a fuss about the Door of Faith Mission relocating to SW 9th St. If they did, it couldn't have been anything in comparison to those objecting to the plans for the YMCA on Dean Ave.

[4th&Court]

Really, the YMCA residence has done this to itself. As I said above, the average citizen only knows this facility for the glaring faces we see sitting on that patio area everyday. They don't appear to be trying, working, "cleaning up" or anything else. Just smoking the day away and maintaining an appearance of being "up to no good." This may all be just perception, but no efforts appear to have been made at any time to change it, so here we are. No one wants that scenario played out anywhere else in the city.

[Better Life dude]

Really, the YMCA residence has done this to itself. As I said above, the average citizen only knows this facility for the glaring faces we see sitting on that patio area everyday. They don't appear to be trying, working, "cleaning up" or anything else. Just smoking the day away and maintaining an appearance of being "up to no good." This may all be just perception, but no efforts appear to have been made at any time to change it, so here we are. No one wants that scenario played out anywhere else in the city.

I think you're over reacting. It's unfair to generalize about groups of people. Since you and I don't know any of these people who live athe Y, wouldn't it be helpful for the YMCA leaders to have a community meeting and/or an open house at their current location where anybody can come and learn more about what they are trying to accomplish? It's kind of like a similar situation with a homeless shelter. People who go to homeless shelters look like bums, no lifes who if they just got a job and a place to live, would solve theirs and everyone else's problems. However, if YOU take time out of your busy life to go help serve a dinner at the shelter and talk with the shelter's directors and staff, you would get a truer picture of the needs of their guests and how a shelter helps the community.

I'll be the first to admit, if I'm walking down the street and I'm within range of a homeless person, I'll go out of my way to cross the street to stay away from them. In my neighborhood -especially in the summer - I get asked for money quite often. We live about 8 blocks from the Community United Shelter on the edge of downtown.

All I'm saying that if you & the rest of us had more information about the Y's program and their program goals, then maybe the knee jerk reactions would go away.

[4th&Court]

Sure, we may not know all the facts as to what the YMCA is trying to accomplish. And as always, we can all do more to assist.

However, I think it's completely fair for people to rely on their own, first-hand experiences and observations. There's no mistaking that my above description of what goes on at the YMCA residence is what you see when you walk past. It'd be kind of hard and unnecessary for me to ignore what I personally observe in favor of the old "unless you're personally involved in this group, don't judge" line.

[DMRyan]

Mark Hansen's DM Register column about the YMCA housing relocation was pretty interesting this morning, in noting that the land for this parcel is currently zoned industrial. Someone could put a coal slag heap or contractor's storage yard on the site, instead of a housing proposal that provides much-needed services to the neighborhood.

I don't expect that to minimize the controversy much though. A light industrial use may be a less intensive neighbor than a transitional housing facility, and it certainly wouldn't affect the school 3 blocks down. The YMCA should be examining backup plans (let's be honest, it will likely be on the east or SE side of town) in case this land does not get rezoned to support their development.

[Philby]

I don't think that smoking and glaring is the true reason posters here (and residents near the proposed site) have an issue with the Y residents - if it was there would be a HUGE uproar over the Qwest building on 10th/High - there are always as many or more people smoking outside that building than the Y - and I've been asked for money by an equal number of people when walking by both buildings (0 - granted I don't walk by the Y THAT often, but I've never been hassled when I have)

I think it comes down to the perception that homeless = bad/dangerous and it's easy to identify someone standing outside the Y as homeless. There's a woman that rides my bus route, and is often on the bus as the same time as I am - I had NO IDEA she was homeless until she was talking to someone else (who may also have been homeless) the other day and I happened to overhear their conversation. Now maybe I have a bad "homeless radar", but I really don't think that anyone would have a problem with someone like this lady living in a shelter near them...

I would rather have someone who's homeless and in a program like the Y (where they're not allowed to be drunk/on drugs, and getting assistance finding work) living next to me than the apartment building that is currently across the back alley from me (definite crack house)

[4th&Court]

Walk by the YMCA in the dark on a weeknight. Believe me, those folks OOZE criminality.

[hawk61401]

Walk by the YMCA in the dark on a weeknight. Believe me, those folks OOZE criminality.

Don't know about the YMCA folks, but this one definitely oooooozes ...