Court Avenue Development Efforts

[Des Moineser]

It is much better, the window frames are now painted a dark green that fits in MUCH better with the district.

[casbern]

It is much better, the window frames are now painted a dark green that fits in MUCH better with the district.

I'm glad that it fits better, but it's still a shame that that building/location is not seeing it's full potential.

[casbern]

What's next for Court Avenue?

Building owners are seemingly putting less money into property maintenance, public space is becoming grimy, how much longer will people want to live in an entertainment district that is rode hard and put up wet every weekend? I know my fiancé and I are considering leaving the district for these reasons.

It really seems like something needs to be done, new businesses need to be attracted to the area, mitigation of the Hotel Randolph and Liguitti tower tenants.

[dsmspence]

What's next for Court Avenue?

Building owners are seemingly putting less money into property maintenance, public space is becoming grimy, how much longer will people want to live in an entertainment district that is rode hard and put up wet every weekend? I know my fiancé and I are considering leaving the district for these reasons.

It really seems like something needs to be done, new businesses need to be attracted to the area, mitigation of the Hotel Randolph and Liguitti tower tenants.

Casbern,

I'm glad someone else is thinking this also. My wife and I live on 4th, which has always had a little bit of a, should we say, cultural mixing bowl feel to it, but the overall Court District is looking awfully tired. With all of the work going on within the next few years in the Core and Gateway District, these areas will likely be where we relocate to. Business owners and residents alike need to step it up and take action to allow the Court District to realize its full potential. Because after all, I'd still rather spend an entire night hanging out with the lovely gentlemen outside the Randolph than with the underage Jersey Shore impressionists of West Glen...

[hawk61401]

There's goood things coming down that ol' proverbial pipeline like the Crane Building, the old fire station, Des Moines Building, Hampton Inn. The Dart Central Station will be opening in a few weeks.

And there's a growing list of regressing ... Now, it's Court Ave. The Science Center and the State Historical Building need sprucing up. Nollen Plaza; no end in sight when it will realize it's full potential. The Hub Kiosk; still an empty shell? Edna Griffin Building, mostly empty. The Younkers Building; it's been over 2 years since Michael Alexander talked about the estimated $40 million rehab of the property.

Lots of well deserved backslapping for the successes of downtown Des Moines and a lot of work left to do.

[DMRyan]

I'm becoming more confident of the Younker's Building being a go based on what I've seen, but the now delayed Hampton Inn project can go to show you that nothing is final until real work begins in earnest.

[casbern]

I'm becoming more confident of the Younker's Building being a go based on what I've seen, but the now delayed Hampton Inn project can go to show you that nothing is final until real work begins in earnest.

What's the reasoning for its delay?

[dogbo]

I'm becoming more confident of the Younker's Building being a go based on what I've seen, but the now delayed Hampton Inn project can go to show you that nothing is final until real work begins in earnest.

There were cranes digging yesterday at the Hampton site.

[wmjindsm]

People's is closing after this weekend.

http://desmoines.metromix.com/home/blog ... 02/content

[dogbo]

Having trouble with the link, but that is a HUGE blow.

[Mastermind]

Zmolek has owned a number of bars in Des Moines over the years, including the A.K. O’Connors chain, which had its last location close in Beaverdale in 2011. Zmolek filed for bankruptcy in July, but said at the time that People’s was not effected.

[SFO2DSM]

Agreed, however with newer venues like Wooly's and Gas Lamp, the live music scene may have had a few too many venues. I enjoyed every show/event I went to at People's, but with that big empty slate someone new will have the opportunity to work with, I hope we're in for a treat.

Having trouble with the link, but that is a HUGE blow.

[casbern]

That sucks, that sucks big.

[MusicMan]

He has been struggling for a few years now and trying to sell it. His rent on the place is outrageous. Something needs to come in and negotiate a better deal. It can still work, just needs to be done right.

[dsmspence]

I think that with the closure of People's Court, something that I've been personally feeling for a while is becoming more and more evident. That is, to say that the Court District needs a major overhaul. I've gathered several of the things that stand out to me as detriments to the neighborhood and organized my rambling thoughts into three points:

• Point One: What was the Surf Shack and is now "Pint's Pub" was an improvement color-wise, but the exterior feels half done and the signage annoys me with its cheapness. Many recent projects in the area are extraordinarily underwhelming. Why, for example, is the former space of Buzzard Billy's still unoccupied? I know there are issues with the flooding and the necessity of a new grease trap, etc. but why haven't either the property owner, prospective business owners or the DCA/City found a way to make it feasible to get that space occupied? It's been empty nearly a half-decade and the space next to Sbrocco is an empty eyesore with loads of potential. I'm concerned with the lack of concern with appearances.

• Point Two: What the hell is with the smoking on patios? One of the millions upon millions of great things about living in Iowa is that as a society, we've kicked smoking to the curb, literally. This is the exact text from http://www.iowasmokefreeair.gov/faq.aspx - "Smoking is not allowed in outdoor sports arenas, stadiums, amphitheaters, and in the designated seating areas of outdoor festivals or other outdoor entertainment venues where the public gathers to witness entertainment events. Smoking is also prohibited in the outdoor seating or serving areas of restaurants; public transportation stations, platforms and shelters; school grounds; and the grounds of public buildings." Both Mickey's and Pint's Pub are MAJOR offenders of this and as for my family, friends and myself it makes me avoid these establishments like the plague. I know this point isn't crucial to redevelopment, but having multiple family members die from smoking-related cancer and heart attacks, it's a big deal for me and several other people I know. My tie in for this section is that the smoking A. Makes the district look trashy B. Accelerates an anti-family friendly atmosphere (I'm in my 20's and don't have kids, BTW) C. Feeds into a growing metro-wide perception that Court Ave is only for "Ragers" and the sketchy gentlemen of the Randolph.

• Point Three: A severe lack of anchors. There are a lot of landmarks in the Court District. Places like the Royal Mile, Shorty's and Dos Rios are unique and wonderful additions to the metro. However, I would argue that only one of these palces (Dos Rios), is a draw for people from other parts of the Metro. What's the draw for someone from WDM to come down to Legend's when there are two in the 'burbs? There needs to be a HUGE draw to make the Court District a true "Entertainment District" rather than simply a "Bar District." The SCI is a great step in the right direction to make this happen, but why can't something be built on the vacant lot across from the Randolph's annex and the 5th and Court garage? Something like a movie theatre or other non-bar related entertainment feature needs to be built to make this area attractive to a larger segment of the population.

Finally, the issue that I feel like is not only the anchor in the mud for Court Ave, but all of Downtown as a whole is an image of sketchiness. If the Randolph could finally get renovated and the current tenants turned out, the area would gain a HUGE boost in traffic. Honestly, the presence of these types of people not only hinders people from venturing up 4th Street (IMO the most historically intact street Downtown) but gives many other Metro residents pause about coming Downtown period. I'd love to see some strong direction either from the DCA or the Partnership or some other group to encourage activity in this area. Court Ave and its surrounding offshoots that make up this district are bursting with potential and an underwhelming Hampton Inn two blocks away isn't going to be the cure to the problems in this area. Des Moines has come SO far since my childhood and I don't want to see any steam lost in Downtown's renaissance. That's my overblown 2 cents worth.

[Emil]

There's been some focus lost on the Court Avenue district. In the end, there's a limit to how much 500,000 people can support, so if there are efforts at bars west or even developments like the opening of Zombie Burger and Wooly's in the East Village Exile Brewing on Walnut there's going to losses elsewhere. Even now, look at how the city is excited at redeveloping the transit mall with some of the same ideas that were originally in place for Court.

It really has always fallen short of the "entertainment district" moniker. It's a bar district. The baseball stadium being with walking distance helps for the general entertainment label some, but in the end the only non-bar option that is there consistently is the Science Center. Its disappointing nature is well-documented here.

[hawk61401]

"BECAUSE JAIL SUCKS!" That's the motto of Iowa Bail Bonds. http://www.bailbondsiniowa.com/

The location sucks too. It's not conducive to the Court Ave area. Sitting there on the corner of 4th and Court, those big ol' windows would look so much better with restaurant tables and ambiance.

<gulp!> not this: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jhdennis/8081668842/

[MusicMan]

• Point One: What was the Surf Shack and is now "Pint's Pub" was an improvement color-wise, but the exterior feels half done and the signage annoys me with its cheapness.

Larry Smithson still owns this. As long as he does, it will be a slummy place. Anything that him or his sons do are trash. I was involved with a deal to try and buy this building a few years back - he won't part with it (except for an obscene amount of money).

[wmjindsm]

Liar's Club will go through a transformation. It will close down this weekend and open back up next month as Joker's. Still owned by the same guy but run under new management. These people run a bunch of clubs in the Waterloo/Cedar Falls area. The bar will be remodeled in a high end Las Vegas type bar with nationally touring comedians performing on Fridays.

http://blogs.desmoinesregister.com/dmr/ ... nd/article

[itsmillertime]

I think that with the closure of People's Court, something that I've been personally feeling for a while is becoming more and more evident. That is, to say that the Court District needs a major overhaul. I've gathered several of the things that stand out to me as detriments to the neighborhood and organized my rambling thoughts into three points:

• Point One: What was the Surf Shack and is now "Pint's Pub" was an improvement color-wise, but the exterior feels half done and the signage annoys me with its cheapness. Many recent projects in the area are extraordinarily underwhelming. Why, for example, is the former space of Buzzard Billy's still unoccupied? I know there are issues with the flooding and the necessity of a new grease trap, etc. but why haven't either the property owner, prospective business owners or the DCA/City found a way to make it feasible to get that space occupied? It's been empty nearly a half-decade and the space next to Sbrocco is an empty eyesore with loads of potential. I'm concerned with the lack of concern with appearances.

• Point Two: What the hell is with the smoking on patios? One of the millions upon millions of great things about living in Iowa is that as a society, we've kicked smoking to the curb, literally. This is the exact text from http://www.iowasmokefreeair.gov/faq.aspx - "Smoking is not allowed in outdoor sports arenas, stadiums, amphitheaters, and in the designated seating areas of outdoor festivals or other outdoor entertainment venues where the public gathers to witness entertainment events. Smoking is also prohibited in the outdoor seating or serving areas of restaurants; public transportation stations, platforms and shelters; school grounds; and the grounds of public buildings." Both Mickey's and Pint's Pub are MAJOR offenders of this and as for my family, friends and myself it makes me avoid these establishments like the plague. I know this point isn't crucial to redevelopment, but having multiple family members die from smoking-related cancer and heart attacks, it's a big deal for me and several other people I know. My tie in for this section is that the smoking A. Makes the district look trashy B. Accelerates an anti-family friendly atmosphere (I'm in my 20's and don't have kids, BTW) C. Feeds into a growing metro-wide perception that Court Ave is only for "Ragers" and the sketchy gentlemen of the Randolph.

• Point Three: A severe lack of anchors. There are a lot of landmarks in the Court District. Places like the Royal Mile, Shorty's and Dos Rios are unique and wonderful additions to the metro. However, I would argue that only one of these palces (Dos Rios), is a draw for people from other parts of the Metro. What's the draw for someone from WDM to come down to Legend's when there are two in the 'burbs? There needs to be a HUGE draw to make the Court District a true "Entertainment District" rather than simply a "Bar District." The SCI is a great step in the right direction to make this happen, but why can't something be built on the vacant lot across from the Randolph's annex and the 5th and Court garage? Something like a movie theatre or other non-bar related entertainment feature needs to be built to make this area attractive to a larger segment of the population.

Finally, the issue that I feel like is not only the anchor in the mud for Court Ave, but all of Downtown as a whole is an image of sketchiness. If the Randolph could finally get renovated and the current tenants turned out, the area would gain a HUGE boost in traffic. Honestly, the presence of these types of people not only hinders people from venturing up 4th Street (IMO the most historically intact street Downtown) but gives many other Metro residents pause about coming Downtown period. I'd love to see some strong direction either from the DCA or the Partnership or some other group to encourage activity in this area. Court Ave and its surrounding offshoots that make up this district are bursting with potential and an underwhelming Hampton Inn two blocks away isn't going to be the cure to the problems in this area. Des Moines has come SO far since my childhood and I don't want to see any steam lost in Downtown's renaissance. That's my overblown 2 cents worth.

100% agree with the Entertainment idea! Take a look at places in Louisville, Austin, Oklahoma City or KC. Yes in cities larger than Des Moines but then we should do it on a smaller scale. A bowling alley like lucky strike, a dueling piano bar, a place with electronic darts and pool tables, a 3 screen theater like Ames used to have along Welch Ave, even an outdoor basketball court for pick-up games. Must be mixed-use but there is a LOT of land and a downtown with a LOT of surface lots in their core doesn't show progress or growth.

[Des Moineser]

These people run a bunch of clubs in the Waterloo/Cedar Falls area.

Darin Beck has been struggling in W-CF lately, guess he is looking for greener pastures. Wonder how similar this will be to the Cedar Falls Joker's. They (Barmuda) did an excellent job with the exterior of that one (its lighting is very bright and changes colors) and it is a favorite with the 21 and up crowd. The cover is usually pretty high by CF standards, however.

[DMRyan]

Joker's seems to be an interesting concept, but I have to wonder if it's better suited for a college town than Court Avenue. I'm all for a legit comedy club in downtown, but I just wonder how well this concept meshes with the masses that routinely frequent Court Center.

This is exactly the kind of nightlife diverisfication that Court Avenue needs so it doesn't end up being soley a bar district.

[DMRyan]

The former People's Court concert space in the Court Center Building is reopening as "The Venue". This new place will still feature musical acts, but they are apparently opening the space up to other events as well.

Nice to see that these closed bar spaces aren't staying around for long, and some new blood is interested in trying different ideas out.

http://desmoines.metromix.com/music/art ... 95/content

[Young DSM Social Club]

The idea for the Exchange bar is very clever. I hope they can pull it off and it actually is as cool as it sounds.

[dogbo]

The idea for the Exchange bar is very clever. I hope they can pull it off and it actually is as cool as it sounds.

I like the idea too but wonder if it is too gimicky? Hopefully it will have staying power. It will be interesting to see what they do to the decor.

[Ingersoll1978]

Looks like Joker's will fit right in!

[wmjindsm]

The old Judge Roy Bean's building (210 Court Ave) sign says a sale is pending.

[casbern]

The old Judge Roy Bean's building (210 Court Ave) sign says a sale is pending.

I hope this goes through. Almost anything will be better there than what is currently there.

[dogbo]

So much potential in that old building. Hopefully this is someone with deep pockets that can restore that buidling into something special. If this is going to be a restaurant again (or bar) , woudl love to see upper floor restored and used with 2nd storydeck coming out the side of the building facing Legend's (over that little alley).

[casbern]

I always thought that this location would make a great billiard hall, a la TCB in Iowa City on the Ped Mall.

It gives you an alternative that isn't on Court Ave right now.